With a win against Geelong at the Gabba on Saturday night, Richmond will achieve the status of an unofficial AFL dynasty with its third premiere since 2017.
Why three is the magic number, and whether it should be or not, are both debates for another time.
The fact is, only two other teams have won three flags in four seasons since the AFL was founded: Brisbane Lions and Hawthorn.
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Big final
Both are undisputed AFL dynasties.
Comparing the three teams is no easy task. The way Footy is played today, compared to when the Lions won their first Premier League in 2001, is almost unrecognizable.
However, there are certain metrics that allow us to play the teams off against each other fairly – and they paint a fascinating picture.
THE PAYMENT
Michael Voss after the 2003 AFL Grand Final (Photo by Hamish Blair / Getty Images).Source: Getty Images
The Lions 2001-2004, Hawthorn 2011-2015, and Richmond 2017-present each have remarkably similar odds, rankings, and profit margins in finals.
Champion data shows that the Hawks have the highest win share, winning 79 percent of their games between 2011 and 2015, where they played in four major finals, won three and featured in another preliminary final.
According to the Hawks, it’s a 74 percent tie between the triple premieres of Brisbane and the Tigers.
For points scored, both Brisbane and Hawthorn were ranked # 1 during their dynasties at 110.6 and 111.6, respectively. With an average of 86.3 in Richmond, it has ranked 2nd as of 2017.
Where the Tigers have excelled over the past four seasons is loud in playoffs, where they have an average profit margin of 39.8 Champion data. That is 5.3 points more than the Hawks’ 33.5.
The Lions have just about the largest profit margin in the final at 41.8, but they played in an era with far higher scores than they do today, which arguably makes the Tiger number more remarkable.
MORE AFL GRAND FINAL PRE-GAME COVERAGE
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ULTIMATE GUIDE: entertainment, weather, and everything else you need to know
PREDICTIONS: AFL experts tip Premier, Norm Smith and the first goalkicker
“HE TAKES THE P ***”: The most overlooked aspect of Ablett’s “immortal” legacy
ABLETT FEATURE: The Child Who Would Be King – How ‘podgy’ Ablett managed to be the son of ‘God’
ELITE EXECUTION
The Hawks with the trophy during the 2015 AFL Grand Final (Photo by Adam Trafford / AFL Media / Getty Images).Source: Getty Images
Three-time All-Australian Nick Dal Santo had the pleasure – or displeasure – of playing against all three groups that were drafted in 2001.
While he admits it’s difficult to compare any team, he highlighted two key qualities that bind them together: leadership and executing their elite game plan.
Dal Santo spoke of the latter, breaking down the teams’ styles and how they became unstoppable.
“You are looking at Brisbane Lions. Everyone knew his style of play, everyone knew that he would, for example, kick the ball forward from a standstill, ”he said foxsports.com.au. “But when they got the midfield they had, they could do it.
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“It was just about stopping her and you just couldn’t do it. We played her in a final once (2004) and you knew your style of play but just couldn’t stop it. They were just really good at what they did.
“You’ve been looking at the tigers for the past three out of four years. Everyone knows he’s playing the ball forward. You are one of the few teams to have won yards of handballs. Can you stop this again? I think they all had their own distinctive style.
“The hawks; Her ball movement was quite violent in relation to sailing. They go 45 (forward degrees), 45, 45 and before you know it they take the ball out of the back pocket in the half forward and you feel like they haven’t gone anywhere with long kicks but they are coming through your defenses really without risk.
“I think everyone has been exceptional at what they do.”
GUIDE
Trent Cotchin and Damien Hardwick cancel the 2019 Premier League (Photo by Ryan Pierse / AFL Media / via Getty Images).Source: Getty Images
Dal Santo said that each dynasty also had outstanding leaders, highlighting Michael Voss (Lions), Luke Hodge (Hawks) and Trent Cotchin (Tigers) as drivers of success.
The 300 player said Voss in particular was one of the toughest opponents he has ever encountered while the former Lions captain also challenged his players incredibly.
“I remember playing him on the spot and talking to team-mates – those were things that were just unacceptable and they were regulated the way they played,” he said.
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“You’re looking at Hodgey – exactly the same. Joel Selwood, the same. And maybe cotchin. “
Commenting on Tiger captain Cotchin, Dal Santo added, “I know the game has changed a bit, how you talk to each other and what leadership is like these days, but Cotchin deserves credit for changing his game.
“Not so long ago he was considered selfish and just wanted to get a lot of ball himself and they didn’t win. He’s continued to develop his game and now he’s one of the toughest players in football and in opposition and it has almost become his role.
“When leaders do that, it becomes the standard and what they have to do.
“It’s probably a general trend that these midfielders in particular are just uncompromising every time.”
MORE AFL GRAND FINAL PRE-GAME COVERAGE
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10 YEARS: It was an ‘imaginative pipe dream’ that was broadcast on television. Now Richmond can make it happen
DUSTY v DANGER: The superstar showdown that defines the flag maker
TIGER INTERRUPTION: The tiger star’s house suspiciously catches fire the night before GF
2020 bumps reinforced tigs
2:55
But the strong leadership within each team’s ranks didn’t have to come from an official source.
While Hodge was arguably the Hawks’ standout player during the finals, the Lions counted on Simon Black and the Tigers on Dustin Martin for match-winning performance.
This table out Champion data Below is how each player’s fantastic Final Dynasty numbers compare.
DISPOSAL
1. Simon Black (Brisbane) – 25.8
2. Luke Hodge (Hawthorn) – 23.7
3. Dustin Martin (Richmond) – 22.5
COMPETITIVE OWNERSHIP
1. Simon Black (Brisbane) – 13.2
2. Dustin Martin (Richmond) – 8/12
3. Luke Hodge (Hawthorn) – 8.4
Undisputed possessions
1. Luke Hodge (Hawthorn) – 1/15
2. Simon Black (Brisbane) – 12.8
3. Dustin Martin (Richmond) – 8.7
RELEASES
1. Simon Black (Brisbane) – 5.4
2. Dustin Martin (Richmond) – 4.2
3. Luke Hodge (Hawthorn) – 3.3
GATES
1. Dustin Martin (Richmond) – 1.9
2. Luke Hodge (Hawthorn) – 1.1
3. Simon Black (Brisbane) – 0.7
SCORE PARTICIPATIONS
1. Dustin Martin (Richmond) – 8.8
2. Luke Hodge (Hawthorn) – 6.7
3. Simon Black (Brisbane) – 5.6
Emotions will not cloud the cats
2:33
So who is better?
It’s almost impossible to see, and any determination will likely be subject to subjectivity – though a Saturday night loss will certainly draw a line through the Tigers.
Dal Santo emphasized the quality of Richmond but also noticed a difference in Grand Final wins.
“The Tiges played the Crows in 2017 and the Crows were minimal after about 15 minutes. They didn’t give much after that, ”he said. “Then you go to last year’s Grand Final where the Giants were in Perth. They were two or three hours behind the game! They weren’t there and they were absolutely beaten.
“Then you go back to the Lions, they beat Essendon (by 26 points) and Collingwood for the second time by nine points. (They had) three really tough finals which was great, then they lose their fourth (against Port Adelaide).
Overseas? Stream the 2020 Toyota AFL Finals Series from outside Australia on WatchAFL. Every game including the Grand Final Live & On-Demand. Grab your Finals Pass to start streaming>
“The Hawks made it a little more comfortable in my opinion … but the Tiges got two really easy wins on Grand Final day.”
So this year’s Grand Final against the seasoned cats could be the ultimate test for Richmond, while a win will be a true dynasty sealer.
“I think this will be their toughest game,” said Dal Santo.
“So I don’t know if that goes into the calculation of who you’re actually playing against on Grand Final day, but I don’t want to take anything away from the tiges.”
AFL Grand Final 2020, Richmond v Geelong, Preview: How Tigers Compare to Dynasties, Statistics
With a win against Geelong at the Gabba on Saturday night, Richmond will achieve the status of an unofficial AFL dynasty with its third premiere since 2017.
Why three is the magic number, and whether it should be or not, are both debates for another time.
The fact is, only two other teams have won three flags in four seasons since the AFL was founded: Brisbane Lions and Hawthorn.
Experience Fox Footy’s Grand Final coverage of Kayo. Stream the latest news and insights through to the first jump, as well as half-time and full-time analysis from the Fox Footy commentary team. New to Kayo? Get your 14-day free trial and start streaming right away>
Both are undisputed AFL dynasties.
Comparing the three teams is no easy task. The way Footy is played today, compared to when the Lions won their first Premier League in 2001, is almost unrecognizable.
However, there are certain metrics that allow us to play the teams off against each other fairly – and they paint a fascinating picture.
THE PAYMENT
The Lions 2001-2004, Hawthorn 2011-2015, and Richmond 2017-present each have remarkably similar odds, rankings, and profit margins in finals.
Champion data shows that the Hawks have the highest win share, winning 79 percent of their games between 2011 and 2015, where they played in four major finals, won three and featured in another preliminary final.
According to the Hawks, it’s a 74 percent tie between the triple premieres of Brisbane and the Tigers.
For points scored, both Brisbane and Hawthorn were ranked # 1 during their dynasties at 110.6 and 111.6, respectively. With an average of 86.3 in Richmond, it has ranked 2nd as of 2017.
Where the Tigers have excelled over the past four seasons is loud in playoffs, where they have an average profit margin of 39.8 Champion data. That is 5.3 points more than the Hawks’ 33.5.
The Lions have just about the largest profit margin in the final at 41.8, but they played in an era with far higher scores than they do today, which arguably makes the Tiger number more remarkable.
MORE AFL GRAND FINAL PRE-GAME COVERAGE
LIVE BLOG: Will it be a Richmond dynasty or Ablett’s fairytale farewell?
ULTIMATE GUIDE: entertainment, weather, and everything else you need to know
PREDICTIONS: AFL experts tip Premier, Norm Smith and the first goalkicker
“HE TAKES THE P ***”: The most overlooked aspect of Ablett’s “immortal” legacy
ABLETT FEATURE: The Child Who Would Be King – How ‘podgy’ Ablett managed to be the son of ‘God’
ELITE EXECUTION
Three-time All-Australian Nick Dal Santo had the pleasure – or displeasure – of playing against all three groups that were drafted in 2001.
While he admits it’s difficult to compare any team, he highlighted two key qualities that bind them together: leadership and executing their elite game plan.
Dal Santo spoke of the latter, breaking down the teams’ styles and how they became unstoppable.
“You are looking at Brisbane Lions. Everyone knew his style of play, everyone knew that he would, for example, kick the ball forward from a standstill, ”he said foxsports.com.au. “But when they got the midfield they had, they could do it.
Fox Sports Sportmail gets the latest AFL news, highlights and analysis straight to your inbox. Join Now!
“It was just about stopping her and you just couldn’t do it. We played her in a final once (2004) and you knew your style of play but just couldn’t stop it. They were just really good at what they did.
“You’ve been looking at the tigers for the past three out of four years. Everyone knows he’s playing the ball forward. You are one of the few teams to have won yards of handballs. Can you stop this again? I think they all had their own distinctive style.
“The hawks; Her ball movement was quite violent in relation to sailing. They go 45 (forward degrees), 45, 45 and before you know it they take the ball out of the back pocket in the half forward and you feel like they haven’t gone anywhere with long kicks but they are coming through your defenses really without risk.
“I think everyone has been exceptional at what they do.”
GUIDE
Dal Santo said that each dynasty also had outstanding leaders, highlighting Michael Voss (Lions), Luke Hodge (Hawks) and Trent Cotchin (Tigers) as drivers of success.
The 300 player said Voss in particular was one of the toughest opponents he has ever encountered while the former Lions captain also challenged his players incredibly.
“I remember playing him on the spot and talking to team-mates – those were things that were just unacceptable and they were regulated the way they played,” he said.
LISTEN TO THE LATEST EDITION OF THE FOX FOOTY PODCAST BELOW OR TAP HERE TO SUBSCRIBE OR SPOTIFY ITUNES
On your cellphone Tap to listen
“You’re looking at Hodgey – exactly the same. Joel Selwood, the same. And maybe cotchin. “
Commenting on Tiger captain Cotchin, Dal Santo added, “I know the game has changed a bit, how you talk to each other and what leadership is like these days, but Cotchin deserves credit for changing his game.
“Not so long ago he was considered selfish and just wanted to get a lot of ball himself and they didn’t win. He’s continued to develop his game and now he’s one of the toughest players in football and in opposition and it has almost become his role.
“When leaders do that, it becomes the standard and what they have to do.
“It’s probably a general trend that these midfielders in particular are just uncompromising every time.”
MORE AFL GRAND FINAL PRE-GAME COVERAGE
NORM SMITH GUIDE: The unannounced heroes who could ruin Dusty’s historic achievement
10 YEARS: It was an ‘imaginative pipe dream’ that was broadcast on television. Now Richmond can make it happen
DUSTY v DANGER: The superstar showdown that defines the flag maker
TIGER INTERRUPTION: The tiger star’s house suspiciously catches fire the night before GF
2020 bumps reinforced tigs
2:55
But the strong leadership within each team’s ranks didn’t have to come from an official source.
While Hodge was arguably the Hawks’ standout player during the finals, the Lions counted on Simon Black and the Tigers on Dustin Martin for match-winning performance.
This table out Champion data Below is how each player’s fantastic Final Dynasty numbers compare.
DISPOSAL
1. Simon Black (Brisbane) – 25.8
2. Luke Hodge (Hawthorn) – 23.7
3. Dustin Martin (Richmond) – 22.5
COMPETITIVE OWNERSHIP
1. Simon Black (Brisbane) – 13.2
2. Dustin Martin (Richmond) – 8/12
3. Luke Hodge (Hawthorn) – 8.4
Undisputed possessions
1. Luke Hodge (Hawthorn) – 1/15
2. Simon Black (Brisbane) – 12.8
3. Dustin Martin (Richmond) – 8.7
RELEASES
1. Simon Black (Brisbane) – 5.4
2. Dustin Martin (Richmond) – 4.2
3. Luke Hodge (Hawthorn) – 3.3
GATES
1. Dustin Martin (Richmond) – 1.9
2. Luke Hodge (Hawthorn) – 1.1
3. Simon Black (Brisbane) – 0.7
SCORE PARTICIPATIONS
1. Dustin Martin (Richmond) – 8.8
2. Luke Hodge (Hawthorn) – 6.7
3. Simon Black (Brisbane) – 5.6
Emotions will not cloud the cats
2:33
So who is better?
It’s almost impossible to see, and any determination will likely be subject to subjectivity – though a Saturday night loss will certainly draw a line through the Tigers.
Dal Santo emphasized the quality of Richmond but also noticed a difference in Grand Final wins.
“The Tiges played the Crows in 2017 and the Crows were minimal after about 15 minutes. They didn’t give much after that, ”he said. “Then you go to last year’s Grand Final where the Giants were in Perth. They were two or three hours behind the game! They weren’t there and they were absolutely beaten.
“Then you go back to the Lions, they beat Essendon (by 26 points) and Collingwood for the second time by nine points. (They had) three really tough finals which was great, then they lose their fourth (against Port Adelaide).
Overseas? Stream the 2020 Toyota AFL Finals Series from outside Australia on WatchAFL. Every game including the Grand Final Live & On-Demand. Grab your Finals Pass to start streaming>
“The Hawks made it a little more comfortable in my opinion … but the Tiges got two really easy wins on Grand Final day.”
So this year’s Grand Final against the seasoned cats could be the ultimate test for Richmond, while a win will be a true dynasty sealer.
“I think this will be their toughest game,” said Dal Santo.
“So I don’t know if that goes into the calculation of who you’re actually playing against on Grand Final day, but I don’t want to take anything away from the tiges.”
.
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